Notes and Queries, Number 180, April 9, 1853

There is a term now coming a little into use, which is I believe of pure Irish origin, namely, old fogie. Indeed, I have heard it used rather disrespectfully of those mature old warriors, whom it pleases the wisdom of our government to send out in the command of our fleets and armies. The word, as I said, is of Irish, or rather of Dublin birth. The old fogies are the inmates of the Royal or Old Men's Hospital, the Irish Chelsea. I think, then, that it must be plain to every one that the term is nothing more than a good-humoured corruption or diminutive of old folks.

This leads me to the simple origin of a word which seems to have posed all our etymologists—it has done so to Richardson at least—namely, "Pettifogger, a low, tricky attorney." According to my view, pettifogger is neither more nor less than pettifolker, i. e. one whose practice lies among the petty folk, small tradesmen, day-labourers, and such like. This derivation, too, has simplicity in its favour.

Thos. Keightley.

Minor Notes

Search for MSS.—A proposal was made some time ago in "N. & Q." by Mr. Mackenzie, that some systematic effort should be made for the recovery of ancient MSS. I have heard nothing more of it, but am sure that, if a beginning were made, it would receive warm support from the friends of literature. There is, however, a kindred search which can be prosecuted nearer home, with more certain success and more important results. I mean a continued search among the numerous MSS. in which so much of our unknown history is buried. Might not a systematic examination of these be instituted, with the help of the "division of labour" principle, so that important portions of the great mass should be accurately described and indexed, valuable papers abridged for publication, and thus given to the world entire? Much is being done, no doubt, here and there; but surely much more would be accomplished by united and systematised labour. How much light might be thrown on a given period of our history by such a study of all the records, correspondence, &c. relating to it. Is there none of our existing societies within whose scope such an undertaking would fall, or might not different societies unite for the purpose? The books, of course, should be sold to the public. I leave the hint to the judgment of your readers.

Elsno.

Clifton of Normanton.—Following the excellent example of Dr. Todd, of Trin. Coll. Dublin, I send you from the fly-leaves of an old English Bible (C. Barker, London, 1599, small 4to.), for the information of any one connected, some of the particulars inscribed on the leaves, relating to—

"Thomas Clifton of Normanton, in the county of Darby, who had issue by his first wife three sonnes and four daughters; and by his second wife, two sonnes and one daughter."

The names of his wives are not mentioned. The details of births, marriages, and deaths extend from 1586 to 1671, and some of the branches of the family went to Rotterdam and Amsterdam, and Newcastle-upon-Tyne. Zachary Clifton was at the Universities of Utrecht and Leyden (at which latter university "hee com̅enct Mr. of Arts, March 5, 1654"), and in 1659 was ordained minister of the gospel at Wisborough Green in Sussex. Many other particulars are given. The Bible is in the library of Sir Robert Taylor's Institution, Oxford, and is in excellent preservation, having been recently carefully repaired.

J. M.

Oxford.

The Three per Cent. Consols.—In Jerdan's Autobiography, vol. iii., published in 1852, we read this anecdote:

"At a City dinner, so political that the three Consuls of France were drunk, the toast-master, quite unacquainted with Bonaparte, Cambacères, and Lebrun, hallooed out from behind the chair, 'Gentlemen, fill bumpers! The chairman gives the Three per Cent. Consols!'"

In Merrie England in the Olden Time, vol. ii. p. 70. (published ten years before), will be found the following note:

"This eminent professor (toast-master Toole), whose sobriquet is 'Lungs,' having to shout the health of the 'three present Consuls,' at my Lord Mayor's feast, proclaimed the health of the 'Three per Cent. Consols!'"

The latter version is the correct one. It was the three foreign Consuls who were present among this annual gathering of grandees that was given; not Bonaparte, Cambacères, and Lebrun. The after-dinner organ of Toole might easily, on hearing the toast, mistake "present" for "per cent.," and "Consuls" (in the City, too) for "Consols."

A Subscriber.

Queries

WOLVES NURSING CHILDREN

At the meeting of the Cambrian Archæological Society, Lord Cawdor in the chair, I read a letter on this subject from the resident at Lucknow, Colonel Sleeman, to whom India is indebted for the suppression of Thuggee, and other widely extended benefits. Though backed by such good authority, the letter in question was received with considerable incredulity, although Colonel Sleeman represents that he has with him one of these wolf-nurtured youths.

Since reading the letter, I have received from the Colonel's brother a more full account, printed in India, and containing additional cases, which I should have no objection to print in the pages of "N. & Q." In the meantime, further information from Indian experience, where mothers so often expose their children, would be thankfully received.

I appended my letter, for want of a better opportunity, and at the request of several members, to a paper on the doctrine of the Myth, read at the time; observing, that if the account is credible, perhaps Niebuhr may have been precipitate in treating the nurture of the founders of Rome as fabulous, and consigning to the Myth facts of infrequent occurrence. There is both danger and the want of philosophy in rejecting the marvellous, merely as such.

Nor is the invention of Lupa, for the name of the mother of the Roman twins, by any means satisfactory. May not the mysteries of Lycanthropy have had their origin in such a not infrequent fact, if Col. Sleeman may be trusted, as the rearing of infants by wolves?

Gilbert N. Smith.

The Rectory, Tregwynfrid, Tenby, S. W.

"THE LUNEBURG TABLE."—QUEEN ELIZABETH'S LOVE OF PEARLS

In the Travels of Hentzner, who resided some time in England in the reign of Elizabeth, as tutor to a young German nobleman, there is given (as most of your readers will doubtless remember) a very interesting account of the "Maiden Queen," and the court which she then maintained at "the royal palace of Greenwich." After noticing the appearance of the presence-chamber,—"the floor, after the English fashion, strewed with hay,"—the writer gives a descriptive portrait of her Majesty. He states,—

"Next came the Queen, in her sixty-fifth year, as we were told, very majestic; her face oblong, fair, but wrinkled; her eyes small, but black and pleasant; her nose a little hooked; her lips narrow, and her teeth black (a defect the English seem subject to, from their too great use of sugar). She had in her ears two pearls, with very rich drops.2 She wore false hair, and that red."

Then comes the passage to which I beg to call especial attention, and on which I have to invite some information:

"Upon her head a small crown, reported to be made of some of the gold of the celebrated Luneburg table."

What was this table? The work from which I quote (Recollections of Royalty, vol. ii. p. 119.) has a note hereon, merely remarking that, "at this distance of time, it is difficult to say what this was." If, anything, however, can be gleaned on the subject, some of the readers of "N. & Q." in some one of the "five quarters" of the world will assuredly be able to answer this Query.

J. J. S.

Middle Temple.

P.S.—Since the above was written, I find that Elizabeth's christening gift from the Duchess of Norfolk was a cup of gold, fretted with pearls; that noble lady being (says Miss Strickland) "completely unconscious of the chemical antipathy between the acidity of wine and the misplaced pearls." Elizabeth seems thus to have been rich in those gems from her infancy upwards, and to have retained a passionate taste for them long after their appropriateness as ornaments for her had ceased.

Minor Queries

St. Dominic.—Was St. Dominic, the founder of the Dominican order, a descendant of the noble family of the Guzmans? Machiavelli wrote a treatise to prove it; but in the Biographie Universelle it is stated (I know not on what authority) that Cardinal Lambertini, afterwards Benedict XIV., having summoned that lawyer to produce the originals, Machiavelli deferred, and refused at last to obey the order: and further, that Cuper the Bollandist wrote on the same subject to some learned men at Bologna, who replied that the pieces cited in Machiavelli's dissertation had been forged by him, and written in the old style by a modern hand.

A Bookworm.

"Will" and "shall."—Can you refer me to any grammar, or other work, containing a clear and definite rule for the distinctive use of these auxiliaries? and does not a clever contributor to "N. & Q." make a mistake on this point at Vol. vi., p. 58., 1st col., 16th line?

W. T. M.

Hong Kong.

Sir John Fleming.—What was the coat of arms borne by Sir John Fleming, or Le Fleming, of St. George's Castle, co. Glamorgan, A.D. 1100? Where is it to be found sculptured or figured? And does any modern family of the name of Fleming, or Le Fleming, claim descent from the above?

Caret.

Deal, how to stain.—I should be much obliged if some one of your correspondents would inform me what is the best composition for giving plain deal the appearance of oak for the purpose of church interiors?

C.

Winton.

Irish Characters on the Stage.—Could any of your correspondents inform me of the names of any old plays (besides those of Shadwell) in which Irishmen are introduced? and which of the older dramatists have enrolled this character among their dramatis personæ? Was Shakspeare an Irishman?

Philobiblion.

Arms on King Robert Bruce's Coffin-plate.—Can any of your heraldic readers give me any information as to whom the arms found on King Robert Bruce's coffin-plate in 1818 belonged? They are a cross inter four mullets pierced of the field. They are not the arms given in Nisbet to the families of Bruce; neither does Sir. Wm. Jardine, in his report to the Lords of the Exchequer on the finding of the king's tomb, take any notice of them further than to mention their discovery.

Alexander Carte.

Chaucer's Prophetic View of the Crystal Palace (Vol. iii., p. 362.).—

"Chaucer it seems drew continually, through Lydgate and Caxton, from Guido di Colonna, whose Latin Romance of the Trojan War was, in turn, a compilation from Dares, Phrygius, Ovid, and Statius. Then Petrarch, Boccacio, and the Provençal poets, are his benefactors; the Romaunt of the Rose is only judicious translation from William of Lorris and John of Meun; Troilus and Creseide, from Lollius of Urbino; The Cock and the Fox, from the Lais of Marie; The House of Fame, from the French or Italian: and poor Gower he uses as if he were only a brick-kiln or stone quarry, out of which to build his house."—Representative Men; Shakspeare or the Poet, by R. W. Emerson.

From what sources in the French or Italian is "The House of Fame" taken? And ought not an attack on Chaucer's claim to be the original author of that beautiful poetical vision to be grounded, especially by an American, on some better evidence than bare assertion?

An Oxford B. C. L.

Magistrates wearing Hats in Court.—What authority is there for magistrates wearing their hats in a court of justice, and is it an old custom?

Parvus Homo.

West Chillington, Hurst, Sussex.

Derby Municipal Seal.—What is the origin and meaning of the "buck in the park," on the seal now in use at the Town Hall, Derby?*

B. L.

[* Edmondson gives the arms, as painted in the Town Hall, as "Ar. on a mount vert, a stag lodged within park-pales and gate, all proper. The seal, which is very ancient, has not any park-pales; and the stag is there represented as lodged in a wood."—Ed.]

Sir Josias Bodley.—Was Sir Josias Bodley, as stated by Harris in Ware's Writers of Ireland, a younger brother of Sir Thomas Bodley, the founder of the Bodleian Library? Who did Sir Josias Bodley marry; where did he live after his employment in Ireland ceased, and where did he die? Any information relating to him and his descendants will be most gratefully received.

Y. L.

Sir Edwin Sadler.—In the Appendix to the Cambridge University Commission Report, p. 468., we find that nothing is known of Sir E. Sadler, the husband of Dame Mary Sadler, foundress of the "Algibræ" Lectures in that university. Can any of your correspondents throw any light on this?

P. J. F. Gantillon, B.A.

The Cross given by Richard I. to the Patriarch of Antioch.—The "hero of Acre," Sir Sidney Smith, received from the hands of the Archbishop of Cyprus, in the name of a grateful people, a cross of which the tradition was, that it had been given by King Richard Cœur de Lion to the Patriarch of Antioch, when he went to Palestine on the third Croisade. This gift was preserved by Sir Sidney with the care due to a relique so venerable in its associations; and it was bequeathed by him to the Convent of the Order of St. John of Jerusalem, at Paris, as successors of the Templars, from whose Order it originally came. He directed that it should be worn by the grand masters in perpetuity. In the biographical memoirs of Sir Sidney Smith, published a few years ago, the cross is stated to be preserved in the house of the Order at Paris. Perhaps some member of the Order residing there would take the trouble to give some description of this interesting relique, and would say whether its style and character are consistent with the tradition of its antiquity? I am not at all acquainted with the evidence on which the tradition rests; but any particulars relating to such a relique must be interesting to the countrymen of the illustrious admiral, and would much oblige his godson,

Wm. Sidney Gibson.

Newcastle-on-Tyne.

P.S.—Apropos of Sir Sydney Smith, may I be allowed to suggest that, in the decoration of The St. Jean d'Acre, recently launched, some personal souvenir might be introduced that would visibly connect his memory with the stately vessel whose name commemorates the scene of his greatest victory.

Lister Family.—In a communication relating to Major-General Lambert (Vol. vii, p. 269.), Lord Braybrooke mentions his marriage with Frances, daughter of Sir William Lister, of Thornton in Craven. I imagine that this lady was sister to Sir Martin Lister, physician to King Charles I., of whose (Sir Martin's) descendants I shall be glad of any information.

Sir Martin Lister married Susanna, daughter of Sir Alexander Temple, widow of Sir Gifford Thornhurst. This lady, by her first husband (Thornhurst), had issue a daughter, who married Mr. Jennings, and became the mother of three celebrated women; of whom one was Sarah, duchess of Marlborough, wife of the great duke.

Had Sir Martin Lister any issue by her? and, if so, can their descendants be traced?

Mr. Lister, of Burwell Park, Lincolnshire, is probably descended from Sir Martin (if he left issue), or is of kin to him, through Dr. Martin Lister, physician to Queen Anne, who, if not a son or grandson, was certainly his nephew.

My mother's great-grandmother was a Lister, a daughter of Dr. Martin Lister.

Any information through the pages of "N. & Q." will be appreciated.

R. B. A.

Walthamstow, Essex.

Family of Abrahall, Eborall, or Ebrall.—I shall be obliged if any of your readers can give me some information relative to this family, or refer me to any work containing an account of it, more particularly as regards the first settlers in England. The arms are—Azure, three hedgehogs or.

Quærist.

Eulenspiegel—Murner's Visit to England.—Are any of your correspondents acquainted with the history and literature of the German tales which go under the name of Till Eulenspiegel? I am searching to find out which are the English translations, but have only succeeded to trace two. The oldest is a very curious black-letter volume in small 4to. in the British Museum, C. 21. c/5, formerly in the possession of Mr. Garrick, as appears from Bishop Percy ("Dissertation on the Origin of the British Stage," Reliques, vol. i. p. 134., ed. 1812). It is entitled, "Here begynneth a merye Jest of a man that was called Howleglas, and of many marucylous thinges and Jestes that he dyd in his lyfe, in Eastlande and in many other places." Colophon: "Imprynted at London in Tamestrete at the Vintre on the thre Craned wharfe by Wylliam Copland."

Of the second I have only a reference of the title: The German Rogue, or the Life of Till Eulenspiegel, 1709.

I am also anxious to learn whether there are any more notices about the visit of Thomas Murner, the author of the German Eulenspiegel, in England, besides that in a letter of Thomas More to Cardinal Wolsey in the State Papers, vol. i. p. 125.

α.

Aged 116.—When your correspondents were all in a state of excitement about the old Countess of Desmond, I ventured to ask for proof that some person had, within the age of registers, insurance offices, and legal proof, ever lived to 150, or even to within twenty or thirty years of that age. No answer was given, no such proof offered; all our clever actuaries were silent. The newspapers now report one such mitigated case:

"Singular Longevity.—The Irish papers announce the recent death of Mrs. Mary Power, widow of J. Power, Esq., and aunt of the late Right Hon. R. L. Sheil, at the Ursuline Convent, Cork, at the advanced age of 116 years."

If this story be true, there can be no difficulty in proving it. The lady was not an obscure person, whose antecedents are unknown. Will some one connected with the Ursuline Convent, or Mr. Sheil's family, obligingly tell us where the lady was born, and produce the register of her birth—give us, in brief, legal evidence that she was born in the year 1737.

A. I.

Annuellarius.—Can any of your numerous readers inform me what the meaning of the word annuellarius is? It occurs in a section of the constitutions of one of our cathedral churches:

"Item, quod nullus quicq' sit qui aliqui alii servit nisi tantum Epī servus sit, in Vicarior' Choralium Annuellarior' vel Choristarum numerum in Ecclīa Cath. … deinceps eligatur."

P. S.

Minor Queries with Answers

Boyer's "Great Theatre of Honour and Nobility," 4to. London, 1729.—At the end of the preface to this work, a copy of which is in my possession, the following advertisement occurs:

"Although this volume exceeds by one-fourth part the number of sheets proposed for subscription, nevertheless it shall be delivered to the subscribers without enhancing the price; and their coats of arms shall be inserted in the second volume; as well as theirs who shall purchase this, provided thay take care to send them, with their blazon, to any one of the booksellers named in the title-page."

I want to know whether Boyer ever published this second volume; and shall be much obliged to any correspondent of "N. & Q." who will enlighten me on the subject.

S. I. Tucker.

[Only the first volume has been published. According to the original prospectus, now before us, the work was to have made two volumes, divided into six parts. So that the volume of 1729, consisting of three parts, is half of what Boyer originally proposed to publish.]

List of Bishops of Norwich.—Where can I find a list of the bishops of Norwich, with their coats of arms, from an early date?

Caret.

[In Blomefield's History of Norfolk, edit. 1739, fol., vol. ii. pp. 330-430.]

"A Letter to a Convocation Man."—Who, I am desirous of knowing, was the author of A Letter to a Convocation Man, concerning the Rights, Powers, and Privileges of that Body, published about 1697, which occasioned Wake's book of The Authority of Christian Princes over their Ecclesiastical Synods asserted? Atterbury says, in the Preface of his Rights, Powers, and Privileges of an English Convocation:

"If at least I were not prevented by some abler hand, particular by the author of that letter which first gave rise to this debate; and who, it was expected, would have appeared once more upon it, and freed what he had advanced from all exceptions."

W. Fraser.

[According to the Bodleian Catalogue, it was written by Sir Bartholomew Shower; but we have seen it attributed to William Binkes, the Prolocutor to the Convocation of 1705.]

Nicholas Thane.—Dr. Browne Willis, in his History of the Town of Buckingham, published London, 1755, says (p. 49.):

"About the year 1545, as we are told in the Peerage of England, in the account of the Earl of Pomfret's family, his ancestor Richard Fermour of Easton Neston in Northamptonshire, Esq., had his estate seized on and taken away from him upon his having incurred a præmunire, by relieving one Nicholas Thane, an obnoxious Popish priest, who had been committed a close prisoner to the gaol in the town of Buckingham."

Can any of your readers inform me what crime or offence this "obnoxious priest" had been guilty of, as to be committed a "close prisoner;" and that Richard Fermour, Esq., who had relieved him during his incarceration, should, for this apparently simple act of charity, have incurred a præmunire, for which he was subjected to so heavy a fine as the forfeiture of his estate? I should be glad of any further particulars respecting him, or to be referred to any work in which an account of him is recorded; and also to be informed by whom the Peerage of England, quoted by Dr. Willis, was compiled, when published, and whether it contains a more copious account of this reprehensible ecclesiastic.

Arthur R. Carter.

Camden Town.

[Richard Fermor was a merchant of the staple at Calais, and having acquired a considerable fortune, located himself at Easton Neston, co. Northampton. Being a zealous Romanist he refused to conform to the Reformed faith, and thus rendered himself obnoxious to the court; and being accused of administering relief to Nicholas Thane, formerly his confessor, who was then a prisoner in Buckingham Castle for denying the supremacy of the king, he was committed to the Marshalsea in July, 1540, and was afterwards arraigned in Westminster Hall, though nothing could be proved against him, except that he had sent 8d. and a couple of shirts to the imprisoned priest. He was adjudged to have incurred a præmunire, whereby all his lands and goods became forfeited, and the rapacious monarch enforced the sentence with the most unrelenting severity. See Baker's Hist. of Northamptonshire, vol. ii. p. 142.; Collins's Peerage, edit. Brydges, vol. iv. p. 199.; and Lipscomb's Buckinghamshire, vol. ii. p. 570.]

Churchwardens, Qualification of.—Can any of your correspondents give the title and price of any work which will define the qualifications requisite for filling the office of churchwarden? The case on which the question has arisen is that of a country parish divided into two townships, each township naming a warden. One of these is a dissenter, and seldom or never attends church; the other is said not to be a householder. Both of these are, by many of the parishioners, considered ineligible, owing to these circumstances. Should any one send the required information, you would oblige by allowing it to appear in the next Number of "N. & Q.," where it would be sure to be seen, and thankfully acknowledged by

B. B. F. F. T. T.

[Our correspondent will find the required information in Prideaux's Churchwarden's Guide, 5th edit. 1850, price 6s., who has devoted sect. ii. "to the persons liable to be chosen to the office of churchwarden, and the persons disqualified and exempt from serving that office." (Pp. 4-17.) Consult also Cripps's Practical Treatise on the Law relating to the Church and the Clergy, 8vo. 1850, pp. 176-201., price 26s.]